Giving Without Overgiving: Creating Healthy Boundaries With Shelly McClintock | 041

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Welcome to the Grand Connection Podcast, where we explore how

meeple connection, grand giving, and collaboration can help us

grow our businesses and ourselves. I first heard Shelley

Maclin talk. I hope I'm saying this right, Shelly. I'm getting

a nod. Speak at a summit hosted by another Grand Connection

member, and her message immediately caught my attention,

and I reached out to her afterwards, like we always do.

You know, sending a message in the chat, and we connected. We

had a wonderful one-on-one, and I invited her to be on our

podcast because this is such an important conversation I want to

have. And Shelly, we have a community filled with givers. We

believe deeply in grand giving, leading with value, helping

others, making introductions, sharing our expertise, and

supporting the people around us. But Shelley's talk raised an

important question for me: Can we give too much? When does

generosity become overgiving? And how do we know when we're

overgiving or simply being kind and generous to the people

around us? And when does the person everyone can depend on

stop being a strength? And of course, how do we learn to say

no nicely while still remaining generous, collaborative, and

heart-centered? And that's what we're going to explore today

with Shelly. So I want to introduce her to you. For

decades, Shelly did what so many high-achieving women do: she

gave everything to everyone else and called it purpose. Today, as

a life coach and founder of Pioneer Coaching, she helps

high-achieving women recognize where overgiving and

overblooming have quietly replaced their own needs, their

own voice, and even their own sense of self. Shelley, welcome

to the Grind Connection podcast.

Thank you. I am so excited to be here. These

conversations are so rich. We're not quite sure where it's going

to go, but it's always just so rich and interesting.

Well, I usually know where it's go because I

make a plan. Because everybody

just about me knows that I like to have a

plan, but it may just go off the plan. You never. I also notice a

lot of squirrels in the room too all the time. So yeah, I love

that. So I want to start off with your story. You describe

yourself as someone who spent decades over giving. So, what

did that look like in your life? You know, I grew up really just

finding my value in doing what I was supposed to all the time,

following the rules. So it meant that my value really had to do

with what I could bring to the table, my activities, my service

to other people. You know, even going to like a dinner party, it

was like, you know, can I help in the kitchen? Can I help clean

up? It really became that was almost easier to find a little

bit of a purpose or a task than to just kind of be, you know. It

was kind of the go-to, and it was it was a little bit of a

safe place. And it took me a few decades to really nail down that

I had my value really all wrapped up in what I did for

other people, instead of just being me-that I was valuable

without what I did for everybody else. So I'm

a kind of opposite. I have to remind

myself to go help out in the kitchen because I get so caught

up in the conversations outside of the dinner. Right, so so this

little thing. Oh, this little reminder. I should go help

out.

So, when did you begin to realize something needed to

change? I think I learned or understood pretty early on in my

adult life that I had really based my value on what other

people thought of what their opinion of me was. You know, I

mean, did people like me? Did they think I was a good, smart

enough, a good student? So it definitely came from being

enough as well, which is something that so many of us

just struggle with inherently. Just insecurity in general. Am I

enough? Am I smart enough? Do I make enough money? Am I good

enough friend? Am I good enough spouse? You know all these rules

that we learn growing up of what a good whatever is supposed to

be-a good woman-and we really try to rise to that occasion,

but if we're not careful, we really allow that to become the

standard of something to always attain towards. Instead of I'm

okay with just being me. So really, honestly, it's something

that I struggled with to a certain extent a good portion of

all of my life. It took getting into my late 40s and early 50s

to really realize that. Wait a minute, this is really not

working for me. This is really directing my life, and one of

the phrases that stood out to me that is part of why my business

is named what it is is that I realized I was asking everybody

else what to do with my life and making choices. Their opinions

were more important than what I really wanted to do, and the

quiet understanding really was is that I didn't know how to

trust myself. I didn't know how to hear my own voice. I didn't

know what my own intuition was because I had relied on

everybody else's opinions of me externally to drive work

relationships, all of it. So yeah, it's about I stopped

asking directions from people who'd never been there, and

that's the catchphrase. Because the reality is, all of us are in

a scenario of no one has ever been us in the world today that

we find ourselves in. No one else has ever been me in 2026 in

my environment and in my world. No one else should be able to

tell me what to do with better understanding and knowing than I

should be able to tell. Now that doesn't mean that you can't ask

for input, and there's people that can give into your life.

But when we kind of give that power away to everyone else

because we really don't trust ourselves, yeah, and that goes

hand in hand. I think that's really the underpinning of

overgiving, because that's why we say yes all the time. We're

afraid to say no because that's either what we're supposed to

do, or sometimes it's almost like eating at a buffet.

Everything looks good. We want to do everything. We want to

help everybody, but if we're not careful, you say yes to things

before even taking a breath and realizing that before you know

it, you've double booked yourself and can't really help

anybody, and you find yourself burnt out, exhausted,

potentially sick, and everything else because you've said yes to

everything instead of really stepping back and pausing and

thinking, well, maybe last year that would have been a yes, or

even last month, but maybe today it's not, and to be okay with

that. Did you have a time where you just you you crashed? Yeah,

it really happened. What really my life kind of imploded. I had

been following the rules in my career, got the master's degree,

followed all the process, had this career trajectory in

nonprofit for years, and I enjoyed my job, but had kind of

this idea of what I was supposed to pursue and when I was going

to kind of make it, and it wasn't necessarily financially.

It was the most money I'd ever made, but it was in nonprofit.

So yeah, but I ended up just it. It did the job crashed and

burned. I was six months into the job that I had been pursuing

for years. It was a natural progression up the chain, and I

realized that I was miserable. I was not happy, and yeah.

So, long story short, I really didn't have a huge choice to

leave that job because it wasn't working for me, but I was so

blind to it that I just kept going, and they basically gave

me a choice. It was like, yeah, we're going to let you go, or

you need to resign. Yeah, I was terrified, embarrassed, all the

above, but. It was the pause that I really needed because I

had to step back and realize what do I really want because

what I thought I wanted wasn't really my truth. Yeah, kind of a

long way around answering that, but that's it's taken some time,

and I still am unraveling all what those rules are and why we

do anything. You know, am I doing it to make the people

around us happy, or is it because what I really want to

do? Well, we all have probably had careers that didn't go the

way we wanted to. My first corporate job I had in my early

20s, I got fired, and I decided to be an entrepreneur, and that

was it. There you go. Have someone tell me what to do

anymore, or controlling my destiny because as an

entrepreneur, we control our own destiny, and we can control what

we say no to. Absolutely, yeah. I think that because of all the

parameters, you know, following the rules, etc. was my safety

net. So it took me a while to eventually make the leap into

entrepreneurship because I didn't have the structure to

know what that meant for me, and I am finding that there's

definitely times that I need to create the structure myself,

because you know, as an entrepreneur, you can wake up in

the morning and there can be things on fire that you have to

address, or things that could be busy work that take you all day,

but don't really make the impact that you need to make. There's

always something to do, and you can say yes to everything under

the sun, and you know end up doing the same thing that you

did in the working world. Tire yourself out. Be doing it for

the wrong reasons, etc. And I've heard people say, "I became an

entrepreneur to be my own boss and work 80-hour weeks instead

of doing it for someone else. So there's there's definitely it

actually gets to the point where you love what

you do so much; it's not work. You're so passionate and excited

about your impact you're making and helping your clients that

you you don't see this as work. My life and my work blend

together so much. I mean, it might not be easy for the people

around me in my close immediate family, but and they end up

becoming often part of my work too. Are and it's it's my life

and I love it. I just love it now, and I wouldn't go any other

way. But I am still working on trying to find those boundaries

to say no and not overgive and be more sustainable. Because

every so often, even with all the systems in place and the

people around me, and I'm try so hard to be organized, I will

take on something that's more than I thought, and I end up

getting overwhelmed and a little bit burnt out. And you have the

small crash. I, I had my big crash where I nearly died back

20 years ago. I don't let myself get to that point anymore. But I

still have these little mini ones where I'm like, okay, I

need a I need a day off. And you're just you're so tired

because you you just worked all night on something you promised

you'd get done for somebody else, and it's about managing

this, and we get better. It's a practice, isn't it, Shelley?

Yeah, it totally is. That was another big

aha moment for me as well that I learned I hadn't really paid

attention to my body either, and eventually, if you do that, your

body will start to yell at you, yeah, and not give you the

choice. And that's where I find a lot of my clients are as well.

So many women end up with autoimmune disorders,

stress-related diseases, and it's really because we've given

over control to other people in how we make our decision. We

kind of feel like we have to say yes. We're in kind of these

unspoken agreements that I'm the one that carries everything. I'm

the one that holds everything together, and sometimes it's

also that no one else can do it as good as I can, you know. Do

that all the

time. I I just go. It'll take too long to explain

it to you. I'll just do it, and then I'm up till three in the

morning, right? Getting all these little things done that

myself

could learn how to do. That's right. That we

create kind of the problem ourselves, get frustrated by it,

and it's like, well, but you have to invest in something

different if you want for

it to

be a little different. So yeah, that's

totally part of the boundaries of realizing, yeah, where am I

doing too much? Partially because I'm a little bit of a

control freak about it. You know, and it's very personal

when it's your business as well. I mean, it's not just your name

attached to it, right? It's it's it's you. It's what you've given

your life to. So yeah, it's it's really just so the keys are

knowing you can't do it alone. There are other people around

you that part of the goal is to bring them alongside, and for

them to grow their gifts and abilities too. But if you never

give them that choice, yeah, you're kind of taking that

opportunity from them too. And sometimes some of the best

opportunities are the ones when it happens, kind of in a chaotic

and messy way. You know, we want life to be just so, but you

know, it most of the time, at least mine, it doesn't work out

that way. You can plan all you want, but you know, the tech

issues are going to come up, or you know, life is going to

continue to life, and if we just want to blame it on ourselves

and just try to work harder when that happens instead of just

finding ways to roll with it and to be okay with those

imperfections, yeah, you're going to get burned out and end

up right back where you started.

Well, I love that life is going to life. I I

really love that. Well, I I recently re-listened to Mel

Robbins' book Let Them, and it just was sort of like I was

thinking with with all the tasks that I don't want to delegate

because I'm a control freak about them and want them to be

perfect. I have come to a new little thing that it can be

okay. We can as long as it's good enough, it's good. And I

just let them, let them do it, let them make the odd mistake.

And as long as it's not serious mistake, the odd email will go

out with a bad link on it because somebody didn't test.

People don't seem to like testing. I like test everything

so much, but that delegation has not gone as well as I want. I

now get like two people. One is a tester and one is the other

one, so that kind of makes them like play against each other. So

they testing happens a little bit more, but there's systems

you can put in that kind of could give you that space for

grace,

right? Yeah, I always find it powerful when

you get those emails that the link doesn't work, and then you

get the second one and they say, "Okay, I'm setting this again

in the subject, right?

Right. That it's just like, okay, the link

works now. That it's just remind you that, oh my God, thank you

for that. Other people are human too, because again, in our world

of like social media and everything else is so polished,

it can really feel like I'm the only one scrambling, I'm the

only one struggling with this, and that's just a load of, you

know what? Yeah, all of us, life is lifeing for everyone. None of

us have it all figured out, and yeah, even Mel Robbins, I think,

would totally tell you that life is going to continue

to life, and none of us are going to get out of

this whole thing unscathed. And it doesn't mean we're doing it

wrong. No, it is a journey, and as our business goes on, it's a

journey. We're learning all the way and experience it, learn

from it, grow from it. I love looking back over the year to

see what I've accomplished and what I've learned over the year,

and the new people I've gotten to meet, and how we-I kind of

will remember you as a person that's taught me about

boundaries, right? So you just think back to, oh, this is a

person. This is what I learned from this person. It's really

kind of a powerful way to go back and see that you are moving

in a direction that you want to be moving in, and all of it is

part of your life and your journey. If you're not enjoying

the journey, it's pretty sucky. Because most of it is the

journey. If you're like thinking about that destination, right? I

mean, how what 5% of your life is the the pinnacles of Mount

Everest, right? If

you're always just working towards that huge

big goal when everything, whatever you know, the angels

are singing when everything's great. That's I say all the time

too. Life is not a Hallmark movie. You know, everybody's not

friends at the end of it, and you know it doesn't work out

that cleanly. And and it's and it's okay when it doesn't work

that that nicely. It again, it doesn't mean you're doing

anything wrong. Life is more often than not the messy middle,

and that's that's kind of what it's all about: is navigating

that and helping each other out in the middle of life, lifing

that that was a hard one. I'll be I'll be really honest because

I realized I was not enjoying the journey. I was continuing to

pursue what was next, and when I reached a goal, I just moved the

goalpost. Yeah, didn't take time to set. Celebrate myself and

appreciate how far I had come. That you know, you just lose

perspective, and it turns into a hamster wheel.

Oh, I've been on that hamster wheel. Everybody

listening knows about Nibbles. Nibbles is my daughter's

hamster, who I had a big affinity with talking to her in

the middle of the night, going, "I'm just like you, but I, I, I

was heavier and she was thin because she ran. Right, right.

Amsterdam, realmark required coffee and chocolate. So

absolutely, yeah, yeah, and that's what happens too. Is when

you get on these these these hen, you're doing too much for

others. You aren't taking care of yourself, and you you go for

vices and things like that that can get you through the next few

days. Now I want to step back to you talked about several roles

you played within this pattern of being an overgiver: the

pretender, the needed one, the caregiver, and the religious

woman. Can you unpack those for

us? Oh wow! Yeah, how much time do we have?

Briefly,

yeah, right. So I think the pretender is

pretty straightforward. That just like I was saying, is that

instead of enjoying the journey and appreciating the the mess

that is life on a daily basis, right? It was let's just pretend

everything's fine. I'm fine. It's all going to be all right,

and I have everything under control.

I think of us are doing that.

Yeah, yeah, ands of our lives. You just

completely take away the opportunity to be vulnerable and

to be real with who you are and the people around us, I mean, we

we know in this age of AI that yeah, the knowledge is not the

problem. the The having the right answer is not the problem.

Everything working out really well is not the answer. It's

really in relationship. It's connection, and that requires

the vulnerability and the human piece of it that I AI can never

duplicate. So yeah, the pretender part is yeah, I'm I'm

I'm fine. Everything's fine. Yeah, yeah.

Okay, what's the needed one? I guess

self-explanatory too. You want to be

that kind of goes back to the dinner party.

Is that when I wasn't quite sure where I fit, that I'm just going

to go help. I'm going to find something to do that keeps me

busy, and then you're always going to feel like that you fit

in, and that's why people want you around because you're

filling a role for them that they they need you. Yeah,

no, that can get into some codependency happening

there.

Yeah, how about the caregiver?

Yeah, that one fits. Gosh, so many

different people in different stages of life. I mean, raising

littles is definitely part of it. I mean, yeah, they they kids

come into the world and can't survive without us, right? And

there are also other people that are on the opposite spectrum and

that are taking care of loved ones or family members. They're

the sandwich kind of generation that they have. Maybe kids still

at home, but they're also taking care of aging parents or loved

ones. So, yeah, sometimes folks end up in caregiving roles

without even really understanding that they're

caregiving. You can caregiver be a caregiver across 1000s of

miles away, but if you happen to be a power of attorney for

someone, or yeah, you can find your identity also in that role,

of you may still have to be a caregiver. Well, how do you set

the boundaries and manage this? Well, you have to make sure that

you have a persona and some kind of hobbies and life outside of

that caregiving. So it's important to have respite care

if you are caring for a loved one. If you're a mom of littles.

Make sure that you are remembering who you were before

those littles. That we all know how it works is that you go out

in public. No one says hi to you anymore. They're always saying

hi to the kids first, or their dog. That's right. That's right.

You know that you kind of cease to exist sometimes as a mom, and

you have to be very intentional about making sure who am I

outside of that persona, and kind of recapture that sometimes

as you need to. That last one, as a religious woman, I think

that that one was really huge for me. That created just

growing up in the church, I don't have any animosity, or I

don't think church is wrong, or that religious experiences are

wrong. It's really just when it becomes exclusionary and becomes

again how I define myself, and that that's the only parameters.

That matter, you know that it has to fit in this really clean,

neat box in order to be safe, and that's really the persona

where it gets it gets dangerous. Because again, I'm saying yes

because I'm supposed to, not because that's what I really

feel that I'm I need to do for me? Did I explain those well

enough? Because each of those

are rules you've gone through yourself.

Absolutely, yeah, yeah,

and you've learned from them. I guess one of your

big learnings is what you talk about is when a strength is not

really a strength. Can you tell me about that? Yeah,

just like the pretender, pretending that

everything's fine and holding it all together and not needing

help, asking for help can sometimes be pretty taboo,

especially as high achieving women. Is that I'm supposed to

have the career or the business or work and be able to take care

of my home at the same time? You know that was a big thing coming

up in the you know 70s and 80s, that I remember when Murphy

Brown even came out. I mean, we could probably do a college

class on that of why it was a big deal to be able to have kids

and have a career, and that that's okay to want both. But

there's people that will still argue with you that you can't do

both well, and in order to do that, most of the time you have

to be willing to ask for help and have to think outside of the

box and what those roles were maybe that you grew up with and

the people around you grew up with about you know what does a

good mom look like, who's supposed to do what?

And I, I see life in seasons. I had businesses

during the time when my kids were little, but I made the

businesses around the kids. Kind of, I had one. It was called

Google Learning. Google spelt like the number Google G O O G O

L, and I had it before Google. Just so you know, everybody

listening. I and it was about math business that taught kids

math and love of learning, and it worked well because I had a

math club, and I was kind of, and they were part of it, and

they were actually in my show that we did this crazy for math

too and all that. So the kids got to experience and learn a

lot, and I also imported a lot of cool math toys from the

states, and was able to, you know, they got to play with them

and learn from them, and really accelerated their own learning

because of being around all of this. I think so. It worked out

okay, but I still sometimes think, oh, I didn't spend enough

time because I worked at home, and somehow when their dad he

went went away to work, they didn't see them. But when you're

working at home and they know you're there, they're they're

there, and they're thinking you're ignoring them. They don't

understand that I'm. Mommy has a job too, just like dad.

Working from home can be really hard to set

those boundaries too. No, no, it

was very hard. So I ended up working late at night

all the time, like super late, and that's where I started

getting run down in my life.

Yeah, absolutely. So you

also said that this strength, the strength

starts working against us, and you relate that to the hero

complex. Do you want to share a little bit about that? Yeah,

it's just being the strong one that has it

all together. You you try so hard to convince everyone else

that you have it all together that sometimes you start to

believe it, and then you feel like that you have to keep it

all together. You know, it's like juggling. You can't let any

balls drop because your first thought is, you know, you're

either going to let people down or people are going to think

less of you, or you know, sometimes we do say yes, and

people are counting on us for things because we've told them

yes, we're going to do that. So it can feel like that we are

larger than life, and it's all right. I'll just keep trying

harder. I'll stay up later. I'll, you know, I'll learn that

new skill, and and it's okay. I will carry it all because I'm

either not comfortable asking someone else for help, or I know

they're overwhelmed too. So I'll just kind of take on more

myself, whether that's out of fear or the hero complex of it's

all right. You just keep on. Your body will eventually not

let you do that, but you can get to the point that you're you're

ignoring all the signs from your body, or at least even on the

inside. That's like, are we really being productive today?

Just because there's things on the to do list doesn't mean they

really have to be done. The sky isn't going to fall, but we

convince ourselves that that's where our value lies. That I

have to be productive, or what does it look like to be

productive today? Yes. Well, I have this new little trick

that's helping me feel better about my productivity, which I

never get done.

What I want to get done, and my to-do list is

longer than you know. It can go all the way to Mexico, so it's

so long. It's really long. But things. What's really cool is if

you look back at a really long old to-do list, there's a bunch

of things on the bottom that you know what don't really matter.

You could just cross them right off, right? That's right. I now

do when before I go to bed, I write down three priorities,

three things I must get done the next day, and and they're

achievable. Like I'm not going to say, write a whole book

tomorrow. It's not going to happen, but three, you know,

simple things, and then I know that I've gotten them done. I do

them first thing in the morning, and they're done. And the rest

of the day feels like this free time to do the things I love,

I'm still getting stuff done, but I've gotten those tasks I

must get done done already, and I feel good about it. I got a

little more that going right.

Yeah, it's so key. I actually am creating a

tool right now that helps people kind of do that brain dump of

you know when your brain is spinning and you can't figure

out like where to even start because there's so many things

yelling at you that you kind of write it all down and and

there's a lot of times once you start to separate those things

out there's some things that aren't even mine and that I'm

giving emotional energy to like worrying about the weather, or

something arbitrary like that, you know, or just maybe it's a

relationship or a conversation that you need to have with

someone, but it's taking up your energy, or worrying about

something that somebody else's like that really is theirs to

own, and yeah, so that tool I'm so excited about it because

eventually you come down to what what's mine, and then things can

be mine, but not now. Maybe it's a long term process, but you

know it can be fun to think about. But you come up with what

is mine and what is now, and there can only be three things

on it, and you eventually come up with action steps, baby steps

that I can take today to address some of those things. Like you

said, not write the whole book, but maybe the goal is to just

create the title or the table of contents or do two pages, you

you create the baby steps because if you don't, your brain

sometimes will not give you credit for how much you do get

done.

Yeah, well, in our self mastery program, the

neuroscience of communication and connection, it's it's a

brain course on brain network switching. But we have one of

the activities we do frequently is what we call a crap board,

and it stands for crap is conflict, resistances, anxiety,

and problems. So what you're doing is a brain dump of all

these things around a problem, and your brain loves to

categorize things. And when you do that, the the release of

energy that you have from getting that done, and then what

we do is we also do some mindful minutes. So we tap into this

salient network, and you get insights. So you're getting that

creative process happening during the brain dump that

really is very very powerful for releasing things, getting it

organized in a new way when you write it down. I love brain

dumps. I do a brain dump every Sunday. I do a crap board

whenever I have a problem. It takes five minutes, and suddenly

that problem is no longer a problem. I have a bunch of

insights, and it's it's a strategy. Yeah, and you've

stopped ruminating and worrying about it, and the energy you

spend on that. That is one of the biggest things I think I've

learned in my 50s. So I'm going to say this time ago, like I've

spent a lot of time in my life ruminating on things, and you

know, you're writing and crafting some email to somebody,

and you read it 100 times, and you're having some drama in your

life. All of those things are unnecessary if you can learn the

strategies to think through it, think it through in a productive

way, and use your creative mind, your intuition, your gut, all

that stuff, and that's like in in the neuroscience we're

tapping into the salient network, which is your

unconscious. It's the part of you that's creative and

insightful, and we learn strategies to actually get into

it quickly. So this is all possible. A life that's less

stressful is possible, isn't it, Shelley? Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

It's

one baby step at a time. One baby, and it's

all a habit. I love the idea of this being a practice. Yes, yes,

and I have a program that it's called the pioneer practice.

That you really come at it from different angles, kind of like a

helix of DNA. That sometimes it's the hidden beliefs that

guide why we do things, what's important to us, our value

systems, and then sometimes it's our actions. That get us in

trouble. We have habits, just like you had said, and you can

come at it from either angle. Eventually, you'll get to the

other side of it, but they work together to create why we do

what we do. And if we understand that a little bit better, we can

learn how to be a little bit more intentional about it too.

Yeah,

yeah, and you know we we strongly talk about

intentionality at the Grand Connection in being intentional

and knowing your purpose. You know the end in mind, yeah, and

you get very intentional on the people you want to meet, the the

marketing strategies you want to do, the funnel you want to have,

like the lead magnet. How's that lead magnet leading to your

offer, it's that intentionality in everything you do that allows

you. You see that what it is. It's a structure. Yeah, it's a

clear structure, and then that's where you have this. Okay, I can

give here. I can give there because they fit within the

structure. Right, right, and it's contributing towards the

larger

long-term goal. Yeah,

yeah. Instead of like, oh, I'm going to go help

you with your dogs. I have nothing to do with not that I

don't like dogs, but right, I, I will help people with their

getting their website done or getting their GoI level done. Or

like, if somebody says to me, I'm really unclear where I

should go with my business and how to monetize it. I that's a

skill I really know well, and I can help you with that, and that

helps me in serving my purpose in life, and it helps that other

person in a great greater impact than me trying to help them with

their dog. That I'm a I'm a cat person, so I don't even know

dogs that well. So I wouldn't be good at helping you with your

dog, and I definitely am not good at fixing appliances. I

like there's certain things not good at, so stay within your

skills, stay within your strengths, right? And when you

can give from your strengths, you're in a place to give well.

Yeah, yeah,

absolutely. I I also want to talk about the

power of the pot because you talked about that. Can you share

a little bit about that?

Yeah, I mean, you've talked about you know how

much happens in in our brain in our processing. Sometimes you

have to give your brain an opportunity to catch up. You may

want to say yes immediately because you really like that

person and you want to help them with their dogs. But if you give

yourself the space to pause. You remember, wait, I'm a cat

person. Stay in your lane, and maybe that also gives you the

opportunity to think of someone else who might be a better fit

for that, and that is actually more synergistic for the two of

them than you doing the activity, and that's just really

an example. If you give yourself the pause, you're not reacting.

You're intentionally able to respond to that, and you give

yourself space to really check in with yourself to how do I

actually feel about that? What's actually on my calendar? What's

actually a priority for me, because just because I really

want to do that for you, doesn't mean it fits in my schedule this

week. And again, you get yourself into trouble and double

book yourself just because you don't follow that pause. And

it's a lot harder to say no later after you said yes. Yeah,

and how many times do we say yes because we feel like we should

obligation, and then you end up doing it, and you're resenting

someone the whole time? Yeah, nobody likes to do things like

that, and we all know that it's not great energy going into

whatever you're creating either, yeah, not not the great greatest

scenario. So sometimes that may mean that you're gonna go buy

cookies instead of making cookies for the bake sale. But

for me, that's just still better than making damn cookies and

resenting someone the whole time. I bought the cookies.

Yeah, absolutely. I try. I'm proud to be the perfect mom for

a while and baking things, and things not turning out. I'm. I

don't cook a lot, so I'm not my skill set. I will though at some

point. I have this little thing in my mind that I'm going to

become an exceptional cook later in life, and there are a few key

signature dishes I can do really really well, so I've perfected

those. But a lot of times, I take out. If you know some good

takeout places, that can be really great. Oh

yeah, oh yeah, absolutely. Um, so we so we

talked a little bit about the pause. I love it. I think that

for anyone listening, when somebody's asking you to speak

on their summit when someone's asking you, "Can I have this

introduction? Say, "Hey, let me look into this and see if it's

right. Even if it's an introduction to somebody, I may

immediately know that it's perfect fit and it's fine, and I

do right away. I do right on calls with people, but there's

times where I say, "You know what? I need to ask them if it's

okay for the introduction." I do what I call a double blind

introduction, and I check with the other person they're

interested in. There's times when people ask me to speak on

things, and I will just stop and I say, you know what, I got to

check my calendar and I got to talk to my family and see what

we're doing and see where I'll be at that time to make sure

it's okay. Because when I commit to something, I want to commit

to it in full. So take those pauses. You don't have to say

yes right away. You can say maybe.

Yeah.

And I like to also do what I talk about in my book

that you've heard me speak about. Those listening with

Michael Neese, Grand Connection member, in his "Our Future Is

Kind" book, I have a a chapter on we talk about no with a

ripple. So how to say no to somebody, but give them still

something positive. So I may not be able to do it, but as you

said, Shelly, maybe there's somebody else that's a better

fit. So I could give them an introduction, or I could say,

"Oh, you could check in this resource. This would be a great

help for you. Why don't you look them up or send them something?

So you're not saying no totally, but you are giving them that

other way that they can continue going through with what they're

trying to solve. So that's very, very fine introductions to other

people who can solve their problem better. It's a great way

to to continue on with giving without causing so much energy

drain for something that you aren't the perfect person for,

and you get to really focus on your genius,

and so do other people.

Now, this also stems to how do you find

boundaries? Like, and we all find them difficult, don't we?

Yeah, I mean, it ebbs and flows. Sometimes

it's that time of year, or yeah, yeah, it's we never get perfect

at

it. Any strategies for people listening on? So I

think that you have to determine what what

your strengths are, what you're really good at with boundaries.

Some people, for instance, may have issues with setting

boundaries on on phone calls, limiting them to phone calls,

setting timeframes on your calendar. So, I believe also

that all coaches need a coach. That just totally makes sense to

me. So, have people around you that can help you see where your

blind spots are and kind of learn from kind of addressing

those boundaries because we have we all have places that we have

energy leaks, places that we're spending time, effort, and

energy because we haven't set boundaries. It could be on your

time. It could be just like you had said. Is there somebody

better suited to actually do this task? Have I said yes to

something that's really not the best fit, or maybe there's also

something that I could delegate to someone else, and my time can

be better served somewhere else? So it's really about determining

where your where you feel like your boundaries aren't really

great, and setting some clear intentions, and talking to your

coach about it. I know that that kind of seems like it's really

vague, but you gotta be honest with yourself, almost brutally,

and be willing to take some feedback from folks-not from

everybody in the world, but there are people that you can

look across, you know, entrepreneurship and be like,

"Wow, they're really good at that. Maybe I can learn a thing

or two. Yeah,

and maybe they're pretending.

You know what? Yep, that could be true

too. Absolutely, yeah.

But most of the time, we learn from each other.

It is definitely a positive thing to be able to see what

other people have done and how they're doing it. Lately, I've

been trying to learn from other people how they're managing

their endless amount of data coming in and the connections

that they make, so that they can remember people with clarity.

Yeah. So there's AI tools around that are doing that, people are

organizing them with agents. So this is something we've been

exploring on sharing with the community is how we're doing

that. And by the time this goes out, we'll already have had the

meeting, so you can ask me about it. And it's going to be in the

learning library. But there's going to be a great talk on how

people are using AI to create agents that can help them

structure their networking in a way that's more efficient and

clear for them.

Wow!

Yeah, so that's it's really cool. I'll talk to

you a bit more about that after the call.

Absolutely.

Yeah, and when you come into a Grand Connection, as

you know, we always give out some free guest passes here. You

know, come and explore and ask about how people are doing it.

That's what I learn a lot. We we do a lot of networking. There's

some people that are power networkers and they're out

networking all the time. And I go, oh my gosh, that's just so

much. I I've had to put boundaries on how much

networking I should do because when you network, you also want

to follow up with everybody, and then you have all these people

connecting with you afterwards. You suddenly have a bunch of

busyness after the network.

Yeah.

And now I'm very strategic about the networking.

I don't give my calendar out in the chats anymore. I used to do

that, and then it would just fill up the next week full,

right? So you can either, if you want to give out your calendar,

have a specific time that's just for networking connection calls.

Make them only half an hour or 20 minutes, even. I know some

people that are doing 15 minute connection calls, so that you

can people and you can have a chance to connect with them,

find out if there's a mutual works. You're aligned in what

you want to do, so that's that clarity around it. Really

creating a boundary, and then you can put more time

relationships that are aligned with your purpose and what you

want to do strategically in your business, and you spend more

time, but you're always creating these connections, and you're

never burning any bridges because you don't know who other

people know, and you don't know where a relationship will go in

the future and the ripples that will be created. So you're

always sending out that good karma in your conversations

because it's positively going to bring you something back later,

and you don't know when, so I like to have these boundaries,

but I still also want to be open too, right?

Yeah, it's definitely a balancing act for

sure. Yeah, yeah. So we've talked about we've talked about

boundaries a little bit. We've talked about the power of the

pause. Talked about calendaring. Another thing we have talked

about, maybe you have a few other things is having the what

is actually yours to carry. We've sort of mentioned this.

What's mine? What's not mine? What's not right for you now?

What's your experience with this? So I learned a lot of that

just in my work life before. I know that you've seen people

having a heated discussion, and you realize that they may be

talking about a certain situation or an event, but

everybody else in the room knows that they're not talking about

that event. Really, they're talking about the situation that

has been kind of brewing under whatever something that had not

been dealt with in the past, and that you know it's like we're

not in Kansas anymore, are we? We're really talking about that

other thing that you don't feel comfortable talking about, so

we're not really discussing what you want to say, you're

discussing. So it's really about taking the time to do a gut

check when something comes up. I think, especially as women,

we're taught to take on responsibly. for how other

people feel in situations at times, maybe even for our kids.

You know, you want them to be happy, you want them to be

comfortable, you don't want them to hurt. So maybe even

friendships-it's the same way. You don't want to make someone

else uncomfortable. That's sometimes why we say yes more

than we need to, because saying no, you know, we're afraid of

hurting feelings or not being the collaborator that we think

we should be, even though someone else can be a better fit

for that situation than we are. So, those are just some examples

Am I really saying yes in this scenario because yes is

what I mean, or I am trying to overgive, or kind of take on the

emotional responsibility for someone else or a situation that

it's not mine to take care of? It's okay to sit in the silence

or to say no, and not have to justify myself, even if that

does make the other person unhappy.

Yeah, yeah, hard to do, isn't it?

Yes, very much so.

That's really hard to do, especially with my kids.

They, I, as a mom, you feel they're still part of you.

Yeah, yeah.

So part nine, I like because this is I've got

these in parts. Is it you don't have to it alone, like so? This

naturally comes into how we do it. The Grand Connection, it's

about collaboration. We connect, create, we collaborate, and you

say you talk about this as well as why is receiving something

harder than giving.

Yeah, I think we're really comfortable in a

scenario of of taking care of things, and there it comes back

to that strength actually being a weakness. Taking care of

everything on our own, just working harder, it it eventually

ends up biting us in in the rear end, but we find that usually

taking action is a much better place of strength or easier to

do than to be in a situation of vulnerability, admitting that we

actually need help, and sometimes it can actually feel.

Like there's something wrong with us that we actually have to

need help, and I think all of that is just-it's all about

stories that we have in our head of what even a successful

entrepreneur looks like. You know, they started in so and

so's garage, and now they're you know have this huge business,

but none of us can do it all by ourselves, or you can try for a

very short period of time. But we know the success rate is is

not great at all. You will end up working yourself into the

ground, and we're not supposed to be great at everything all

the time, so

there's only so much time in our lives, so much

time in the day, and we have to figure out what we're good at.

What are our strengths?

And it gives other people the opportunity to

use their strengths too. But if we don't even give them the

opportunity, because we think again we've got to carry it all

on our own, it it's so much more fun to do it with other people

too,

but a lot of people really struggle to to

receive.

Yeah, where you know it's always better to

receive to give than to receive. You know, I mean, yes, that's a

belief we have. It's better to give. Yeah, even

you feel bad and guilty, or maybe you would owe something to

somebody, and you kind of just-I'll just do it. It's okay.

It's okay. I-I-I do still do that. It's okay. I'll do

it. Yeah. There's definitely times too

that there there have been. We all have had experiences that

there's strings attached to things as well, and that's where

I think it goes back to what's mine and what's not mine. Is

that if someone offers to help and they want there to be

strings attached to it. It's whether it's an intended

manipulation or not. That's their choice and not yours. So

if someone offers to help, it's okay to receive it if you feel

comfortable with it and don't feel like there's an automatic

reciprocity. If you can do that in in a if you have the overflow

to give to someone, that's amazing. But it's it's not

really healthy to just keep score all the time. No, no. So

like yeah,

there's a book I I talk about a lot, Adam Grant's

Givers Givers and Takers, and there's also matchers. So the

matchers are keeping score all the time, right? And it kind of

gets stressful, and it has this funny feeling around it. I just

I just like to be the giver, but I want to be a giver that's a

wise giver that is doing things from my own own state of

abundance and to be sustainable. So that's why I love talking to

you, Shelly, because that's what I'm working on right now in my

life is how to do that. And I know there's lots of other

people that are to do that. And you have tools for people,

right? So I do have

one of the biggest things I have is an

assessment that it's called: is it dedication or disappearing,

and it's really just some it's some questions that you ask

yourself in a scenario. Am I more likely to say yes in a

scenario because I feel like I have to? Am I showing up because

it's my role in the relationship, and because I feel

like it's expected of me, and it's easier than saying no and

dealing with the drama potentially that might be around

that. So that's the dedication piece. We think it's dedication

though, and we're actually we're just playing a role, and it's

not where you're giving out of. Yeah, I really want to do that

for you. It's that. Yeah, I I guess I will because I've always

done it that way. You have to exactly because it's roles that

you're playing, and everybody expects it of you, and you know

the reality also is that we treat we we teach people how to

treat us by continuing to allow patterns to go on. If we

continue to show up for people in ways that deplete us and that

we're really not happy about and have joy about. We're partially

to blame for some of that, you know. It's easier sometimes to,

you know, play the victim card and say, "Well, they expect me

to, or "I've always done it this way, and I don't know what

they're going to do. Going back to even your kids, I don't know

what they're going to do if I don't do this for them. Well,

maybe it means they end up doing their own laundry and end up

with some pink T-shirts, you know.

But we

found pink T-shirts in our house, right?

And you know, that's just that's just an example, but it's really

helped. You discern are there times that you just

automatically show up out of rote responsibility, and it's

really not you showing up. You're really not present for

the scenario. It may be under the guise of being dedicated,

and I'm I'm you know a good wife, partner, etc. Mom, but is

it just because that's the way we've always done it? You know

that that may not always be the answer. And with that, there is

a-it's just a snapshot. So you know there are some

relationships that maybe we show up differently in. You know,

family can be challenging sometimes. Maybe your best

friend. It's not like that, but maybe with family it can be

tricky. So it's really just a snapshot assessment, and I would

be so ecstatic. Anybody that takes that and would like to

unpack it, I would love to do that with them, and no judgment

whatsoever. I mean, I have a heart for this work because I've

lived it, and yeah, I I feel I don't have it all figured out,

but definitely feel that I'm on a brighter side because I have

decided that it's okay to say no, and it's okay for other

people to feel uncomfortable with that. I don't really owe

them their comfort level. I owe more to me and to take care of

me than them to be comfortable because no one else is going to

show up to take care of me. No one else is going to do it for

me. I have to decide to be the hero for myself that I really

wish other people would be for me. Beautifully said. Now you

have a gift for our listeners. Yes, I do, and that is the

assessment tool. Is it dedication or disappearing? And

the there's a call after that that I would be more than happy

to have just break it down. What does that look like for you?

What are the relationships that that shows up in? And the intent

at the end of all of that discussion is, what do you want

to look differently? How would you like what life to look if

you didn't have that pattern that you end up on the hamster

wheel about? What would life look like if you weren't on that

hamster wheel in that situation? What would it free up in your

time and your energy level? And maybe dream a little bit about

that because once you get some energy around it, it's not all

about I need to stop doing this. It's about it will free me up to

do some other things that I really could find some more joy

in, and it takes a little bit to get there. But we are the are

captains of our own ship, and when we are disappearing into

these relationships, into these roles, and saying yes without

even really meaning yes, we're not piloting our own ship. We're

letting other people captain it, and and then this sands back

to having people around you and not being alone.

Because once I had this vision, I thought, you know what, I need

to get more space for grace in my life. My parents are aging,

and I want to be there. If somebody's sick, I want to be

able to drop everything and go and go and see them. And I am

working really hard now, so I'm putting a little more time in

the moment. I'm investing, but I have that purpose of the space

that I want to have. But members in my community, I've been

talking about this as my challenge, and they come and

help me get ideas on how to automate things and different

resources that could delegate. And some members have stepped up

and are co-hosting some of our bigger events that I used to do

all by myself was super stressful. They're taking off a

lot of the the stress for me, but it's a win win. Like they're

they're doing their things, and you know some people I'm paying

to because we we want to create value in the world to see for

the value, and it's just been this wonderful feeling that I'm

not alone, and these people are around me that are helping me

towards my goal to have this space and grace and to have more

more boundaries around my world, and

I imagine a good portion of those you

couldn't have orchestrated all by yourself in your head. Like

you had no idea those opportunities were going to come

up, and they they were really great pleasant surprise, but

until you made yourself vulnerable and shared, I'm

wanting something different eventually or whatever. You're

inspiring other people to be able to step up and learn new

skills and yeah, it's it's such a ripple. Throughout so many

things, and you don't have to pretend to figure it all out by

yourself.

No, it it does start to come once you know what

you're looking for, and you you share it with other people.

Yeah, absolutely.

So one final question, because I always like

to leave the listeners with something they can immediately

put into practice. So for the person listening right now who's

realized I'm doing too much, I'm giving too much, I'm caring too

much, what is one thing you would encourage them to do

today?

I would encourage you to take a moment

and ask yourself, "What can I do to take care of me today? It

could be as simple as go for a walk. It could be I'm going to

drink more water today. I mean, some of us that can turn into

workaholics. It could be I'm going to go to the bathroom when

I really need to go, instead of waiting for-I mean, all the

teachers out there, right-that end up with UTIs. I mean, it's

that I'm going to listen to what I need today and to understand

that that could be very different from what it looked

like yesterday or tomorrow. But what would it look like to take

care of myself today? It could be that I'm going to eat really

good food. It could be that I'm going to spend five minutes

reading a book that I really want to, or to maybe not stress

about all the things on your to-do list, and to just cut

yourself some slack and be like, okay, maybe it's not all done

today. Yeah, what what does that look like today?

That to do list for everybody listening. I'm

never gonna be done my to do list. It's okay.

Yeah,

let it go. Let them let them just live on the

rest. Do three things that are the most important and work your

way through your life, and what was the saying? Life. Let what

is the saying of a life?

Life is

gonna life. Yeah, life is gonna life. So, Shelly,

thank you. And you are one of my people that's come into my world

too to inspire me to have more boundaries and become a better

giver. One of my biggest takeaways from this conversation

is that generosity and boundaries don't have to be

opposites. Grand giving doesn't mean saying yes to everything.

Sometimes giving means helping. Sometimes it means making an

introduction. Sometimes it means sharing a resource. Sometimes it

means allowing somebody else to contribute. And sometimes the

healthiest answer we can give is no. I also love the reminder

that we don't have to carry everything ourselves. When we

understand what is ours to carry, respect our own time and

resources, and allow other people to contribute their

strengths too, we create space for healthier relationships

and more meaningful collaboration.

Perhaps one of the most important lessons is also the

we don't have to do it alone. That's part of the power

of community and collaboration. We each bring different tools.

We've got a tool here today that you can get in the show notes.

We bring different strengths, experiences, and connections to

the table, and that's how we grow together. So, Shelly, where

can people get in touch with you? Yeah, my website is

pioneertogether.com. So you can, I you can also find me on

LinkedIn, just searching for my name. But you can access the

gift that I'm providing as well. It is pioneertogether.com, and

I'm sure it'll be in the show notes as well. But it is forward

slash is it dedication with dashes in between, so that will

take you directly to the tool, and there's you know some other

cool stuff there as well. Just some resources and fun things

that we talk all about. All of these things that you know

sometimes are a little bit harder to talk about, but it

helps to determine as a snapshot, where am I today in

this scenario? Where do I feel like that I'm maybe doing a

little bit more than I need to, and maybe it's not the best use

of my time? So, yeah, I would totally love for folks to take

opportunity to use that gift, and I'm willing to also unpack

that with people in a complimentary one-on-one call.

Oh, that's an amazing gift. Well, thank you, Shelley. If too

many people call you, what are you going to do? Well, we're

just going to have to plan it forward in the calendar, you

know, into the new year, I guess.

Yeah, whenever it'll get done when it needs to

get done. Thank you so much, and don't forget, listeners, we have

the Grand Growth Bundle and your free guest pass at

GrandConnection.ca forward slash gifts. And if you enjoyed

today's conversation, please subscribe to the Grand

Connection podcast and share this episode with someone who

might need the reminder that they don't have to carry

everything themselves. Don't forget to grab your free Grand

Guest Bundle at GrandConnection.ca/gifts. And

until next time, keep connecting, creating, and

collaborating. And Shelly, thank you for being part of the Grand

Connection podcast.

Thank you. I've so enjoyed this. It's been

great.