In this episode of The Healers Café, Manon Bolliger, speaks to Ken Blackman who discusses the dynamics of breakups, highlighting that anxiously attached individuals often initiate them. Blackman advocates for building relationships that provide mutual support, especially during challenging times, to foster long-term happiness and health.
For the transcript and full story go to: https://www.drmanonbolliger.com/ken-blackman
Highlights from today's episode include:
Ken explains Chemistry vs. intimacy: A great relationship needs both spark and the safety to be fully yourself, not constantly "protecting the vibe."
Ken explains Healthy breakup: A loving split sounds like "I see you, I get what you need, it's valid—but it's outside my range," with mutual respect, grief, and relief.
Manon explains Real freedom: What feels most free is not many partners, but being completely yourself—"weirdness" and all—with one person who truly gets you.
ABOUT KEN BLACKMAN:
A former Apple engineer turned relationship mindset coach and intimacy educator, Ken Blackman is currently celebrating his 25th year helping couples co-create a thriving, fulfilling life partnership and a gourmet love life. His work has garnered mentions in Business Insider, Playboy, Tim Ferriss's 4-Hour series, Cosmopolitan, and elsewhere. He's a regular featured contributor to The Good Men Project, Better Humans, and his own Medium publication, The Craft of Intimate Coupledom.
Core purpose/passion: I think my superpower as a relationship coach is to be a translator and help them see and understand each other. I tend to listen and ask, listen and ask, until I feel like I see the world through one partner's eyes. Then I do the same with the other partner, listen and ask until I see the world through their eyes. Then I help them see each other. Sometimes translation; is just saying to one partner exactly what I heard the other say, but as though I'm speaking to the most important, honorable person in the world, whom I have the highest regard for.
– Facebook | Instagram | Medium | Website | BlueSky | Threads
ABOUT MANON BOLLIGER, RBHT, FCAH:
As a retired Naturopath 1992-2021, I saw an average of 150 patients per week and have helped people ranging from rural farmers in Nova Scotia to stressed out CEOs in Toronto to tri-athletes here in Vancouver.
My resolve to educate, empower and engage people to take charge of their own health is evident in my best-selling books: 'What Patients Don't Say if Doctors Don't Ask: The Mindful Patient-Doctor Relationship' and 'A Healer in Every Household: Simple Solutions for Stress'. and What if Your Body is Smarter than You Think? I am the Founder & CEO of The Bowen College Inc. which teaches BowenFirst™ Therapy and holds transformational workshops to achieve these goals.
So, when I share with you that LISTENing to Your body is a game changer in the healing process, I am speaking from expertise and direct experience".
Mission: A Healer in Every Household!
For more great information to go to her weekly blog: http://bowencollege.com/blog.
For tips on health & healing go to: https://www.drmanonbolliger.com/tips
Follow: Manon Bolliger website | Linktr.ee | Rumble | Gettr | Facebook | Instagram | YouTube | Twitter | LinkedIn |
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* De-Registered, revoked & retired naturopathic physician after 30 years of practice in healthcare. Now resourceful & resolved to share with you all the tools to take care of your health & vitality!
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Introduction: Welcome to the Healers Cafe, the #1 show for
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medical practitioners and holistic healers to have heart
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to heart conversations about their day to day lives while
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sharing their expertise for improving your health and
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wellness.
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Manon Bolliger: Welcome to the Healers Cafe today. I have with
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me Ken Blackman, and he his organization basically is about
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sovereignty in connection, and he helps indecisive couples
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either commit fully or separate amicably without fear or regret
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and and then those who go on, he helps them craft a thriving,
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loving, fulfilling life partnership. So I mean, that
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seems like a wonderful thing to do. You can't lose. So what?
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Give us a little bit about your background and how you ended up
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in this field?
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Ken Blackman: Yeah. So in my 20s, I was a software engineer
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at Apple, right? And I was relatively successful, you know,
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like most of my life was, I had friends, I had some spending
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cash, I did fun things, but I I was terrible when it came to
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relationships, just awful. Like I was bad in every way that you
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can, that you can, you know, think of I was codependent, I
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was misogynistic. I had nice guy syndrome. I was whiny and needy
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as a boyfriend, I was bad in bed, like you name it. I was
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just not I didn't know what I was doing, and I needed the kind
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of help that I now offer to other people. Like I needed,
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like, support and coaching and mentoring and like how to have a
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healthy, intimate, mature, like fulfilling relationship with it,
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with another human being. And that was so transformative for
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me that I thought this is the work that I want to do. I want
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to help other people have, what, what, what I'm now experiencing
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with women. And so I left my career, and, like, studied with
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my mentors, and like, like, just did a deep dive into what it
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takes for people to have great relationships, and I've never
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looked back. This is what I've been doing full time for 25
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years.
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Manon Bolliger: Now that's, you know, it's a long time. If you
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weren't going to have any doubt he would have stopped by now.
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So, yeah, so what? I mean, what does it take to know that you
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that you should get out of a relationship? Let's start with
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that. Because I think a lot of people, you know, I mean, I have
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no direct couple relationship, you know, counseling or 30 years
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working with people. A lot of health issues come from their
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relationships, right from the things they can't deal with, the
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stress that it has, the unresolved stuff, but they
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don't, dare say, not standing up for themselves, like a whole
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bunch of things that give stress and affects your your health. So
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what, what have you found? Are they, maybe the main things that
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where people don't they, they have a sense they should be a
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part, but they can't do it. What are the the things that hinder
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this?
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Ken Blackman: Yeah, I mean, wow, I could go in so many different
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directions. There's somebody, but let me, let me start here.
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There's probably a lot to talk about, but let me start here.
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There's chemistry, which is, you know, like attraction and how it
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good, feels good to be with the other person. And then there's
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like connection and intimacy, which is your ability to be
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yourself. So if you so a lot of people who have chemistry, what
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they're what they find is that they it feels really good. And
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then they're really protective, like they don't want to say
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something that's going to kill the vibe. You know, they start
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to present them their best self, and, and they're doing a lot of
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management to have it feel good. Do you know what I mean? Yeah,
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yeah. And, and then there's intimacy and connection, where,
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really what feels good is, can you be yourself with this human
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being, like, are you able to be yourself? And hopefully you have
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both, because if you have chemistry, like, if you're going
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to be in a long term relationship, people don't
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really understand. Transition from we're dating, where you
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you're doing, you're on your best behavior, to what it takes
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to create a life partnership like a real you. This is the
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person you want to do life with. If you haven't transitioned into
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you can really, really be yourself with this person. If
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you're still like, trying to protect the vibe. If you're
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still trying to, like, like, you know, juice, juice, the
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chemistry, that after a while that's that's going to be
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tiring. And people say, I just like, I, you know, they've been
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in the relationship for a while, and they, they kind of feel like
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they, they need some time alone. They need to get away all that
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stuff. That's because they have a relationship where they can't
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actually be themselves,
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Manon Bolliger: right? Right? Yeah, makes it so
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Ken Blackman: ideally, what you what you want, is to be able to
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have both. But that takes courageous honesty, like think
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about the things that you are most afraid to share with your
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partner, because you're afraid, like the things that you are
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most afraid, if they knew this, they would want to leave. That's
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the stuff that you need to share in order to get into this deeper
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territory where you're genuinely, truly connected with
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this person. This person has your back there. You know that
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they've chosen you, not some facade like this is you've
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chosen each other to be like your your most important person
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in your life. You don't want to spend the rest of your life with
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someone that you have secrets from, have to put on, put on a
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mask with, or that you have to hide something from so it takes
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this very courageous level of honesty to get into that
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territory, but we all hunger to have that kind of person, that
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person who's who's really our person. So no
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Manon Bolliger: make sense? Because if you're ultimately, if
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you can't be yourself, it's just too much work, or if you're on
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eggshells, or, I mean, I've been a few relationships, so I can
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tell, you know when, when, finally, I'm comfortable. I am.
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I myself, I do, you know, sometimes weird things, but it's
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me, and it's really fine. I think that's like, it's so much
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nicer than, yeah, then that sort of in between, but then you also
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need the chemistry. So what? How do you like? So let's say you're
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starting new with somebody, and you get along. The vibe is
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right? You you're, you know, there's a lot of people that are
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faster now to be more themselves. It's becoming more
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popular than it was. But would How do you explain chemistry and
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does chemistry disappear? Does it in your mind? How does it
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work? Is it something to also work on? Or is it always there?
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Or can you,
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Ken Blackman: you know, I yeah, there's this belief that, you
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know, like a good like people crave variety, or that they
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crave novelty, especially in the bedroom. I haven't found that to
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be the case at all. I actually think, when you're really, when
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you're really connected with someone and honest with someone,
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and you can talk about things, you can actually craft a love
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life that's better than what you can find. You know you can, you
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can have craft it to be better than what you can find. So the
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example that I can imagine a couple who decide that they're
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going to have they're going to have dinner together a couple of
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nights a week. They're going to make dinner together and just
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enjoy, enjoy a meal together a couple of nights a week. So you
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know, first you have to figure out what's your dietary
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restrictions. What's your dietary restrictions, what do
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you love to eat? What do you love to eat? And they may not
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perfectly match up, but you figure out, how do we make a
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meal where both people are getting up totally happy with
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the meal, right? That's totally possible. Then, you know, you've
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got, you've got your meals dialed in. Then you start to
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experiment with different cuisines. You get better. You
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get your flow in the kitchen, you know, like, one person's
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really good cooking the steak, no one's really good, you know,
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roasting the asparagus. You know, you you learn to start
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experimenting with different flavors and different you know,
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like, well, let's try this. We haven't made this recipe. You
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start to play with recipes, and you start to like, make recipes
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your own. But you're, each time you're talking about the
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experience, you're saying what you like you what you don't
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like, you're like, really relating over the meal, right?
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You're not just like, picking a recipe in silence, cooking in
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silence, you know? Right? Eating in silence. You're talking,
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you're like, you're relating over what's enjoyable. So after
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a few years, those meals are going to be dialed in, because,
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because you've been working together, you know? So your your
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love life can be that way too. So that's, that's how I think
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about it, like the best of what relationship can offer, the best
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chemistry, the best juice, the best you know. The best of it
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is, when you're with someone who knows you so well, they know
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what feels good to you. They know what right way. They know
00:10:33
you so well. They can anticipate. They can like,
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flirt. They can like, there's, there's this dynamic between two
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people who know each other really well, that, I think, is
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the best of what's of what's possible, not knowledge, not,
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you know, right variety,
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Manon Bolliger: yeah, yeah, no, I would concur, you know, but
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it's, it's true, that it's really a belief out there, not,
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I don't think, I mean, I don't know, maybe that's not true. No,
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I'll take that back. I've heard it more from from men, but I, I,
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I'm now hearing it also from women who start to believe that
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that's true, because so many are not, you know, planning to
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really settle down, not have kids, all this business. So they
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think it's a freedom, you know, but I don't know that that's
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really freeing. It's more freeing to really get to know
00:11:30
yourself fully and be with another, you know. So yeah,
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Ken Blackman: there's this, there's this amazing quote from
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Joni Mitchell, oh, yeah, and she picked it up from a magazine
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article that she read. But basically, if you want the same
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experience again and again and again, keep seeing other people.
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If you want infinite variety, stay with one person. And the
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reason she says that is because when you first, when you first
00:12:00
get with someone, you know you've got your stick, you've
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got your moves, you got, you know, like the stories you
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haven't told them yet. You know you like all this stuff that's
00:12:08
new, right? And pretty soon you've gone through all your
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best your all your best moves, all your best stories, all you
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know. And at that point you know each other, and you actually
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have to break into new territory together, and you have to talk
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about stuff you've never talked about before. You have to, like,
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get to know each other at a new level, like, that's when the
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relationship begins. The, you know, the really good stuff
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begins after you've gone through all of your your tricks and your
00:12:39
sticks and your you know, then, then the possibility of
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something new that you've never experienced before is possible.
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Manon Bolliger: No, I yeah, I would think that that is true.
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It's, I mean, I've experimented so many things based on belief
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systems. You know, when I I saw that, you know, so many people
00:13:02
so called cheated. I thought, well, I'll never be in a
00:13:05
relationship like that, because I don't believe in that. So I'm
00:13:10
going to call it an open relationship, and therefore it's
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allowed, and therefore it's not cheating anymore, you know, and
00:13:19
and in some ways, theoretically, at the time, many years ago, 40
00:13:25
plus, anyway, it felt completely right. It felt it felt like
00:13:31
freedom. But it wasn't freedom. In the end, it didn't feel that,
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yeah, it's like you couldn't go further with one even though you
00:13:44
might be more attached to one person. It's like, no what? Why?
00:13:50
Why am I not developing all of it? And you know, why am I not
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addressing that original feeling or that fear, you know, that I
00:14:00
would be cheated on, or whatever it is that, you know, yeah, it's
00:14:07
funny.
00:14:07
Ken Blackman: You should bring that up. I practiced like being
00:14:10
in open relationships for years myself, yeah, and what, what we
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liked about it was, I'm not going to tell you what not to do
00:14:22
with someone else in order to have what you want with me.
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00:15:36
Ken Blackman: like, I'm not gonna You don't have to limit
00:15:39
what you have with someone else in order to have everything,
00:15:41
like I care about how the two of us relate. Do you know what I
00:15:44
mean? So there was this great freedom and not limiting each
00:15:49
other and not shrinking each other in order to have
00:15:52
something. And what, what I found was that over time, there
00:15:58
got to, you know, if you're really developing with, with one
00:16:01
person, you get to a place where it's like, oh, this. I don't
00:16:06
really want anyone else. Like, I'm, I'm really liking what we
00:16:10
have at home, you know I mean, like, I don't feel drawn to
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anyone else because I, I'm really digging what, what we've
00:16:16
got. That's, that's where you can get to with that, you know
00:16:19
what? I mean, yeah, it isn't. It isn't. It isn't building a moat
00:16:25
around yourself. No, no, exactly No. Get in. It's, it's crafting
00:16:30
something with someone that that just feels amazing
00:16:35
Manon Bolliger: in where I'm at now. It's, it's actually the
00:16:40
most freeing of all relationships, and I've been
00:16:44
doing this one for 20 years, and it's we. We talk completely
00:16:49
freely, and I'm totally free, but there's absolutely no desire
00:16:55
by either of us, you know. But there's the freedom juice and
00:17:01
and it's sort of, it's almost like there's so much fun
00:17:05
developing and, like you say, new territory, things that,
00:17:10
well, I haven't had to look at this situation, or what it's
00:17:13
like to deal with someone in pain, or what it's like to deal
00:17:17
with trauma resurfacing, like you can go so deep and learn so
00:17:23
much, like both partners, right? Then it's like, why would you
00:17:27
want to? You know, it's not, it's not even fun. But when I
00:17:31
think about it, oh, what's it's fun to meet new people a little
00:17:36
bit and then, but it doesn't really like, I'd rather go back
00:17:39
and be home. You know, that's the feeling.
00:17:42
Ken Blackman: Now, I know that's how I feel too. Sometimes I'm
00:17:46
going to spend the rest of my life getting to know my wife
00:17:50
like that's that is a lifelong process of getting to know this
00:17:53
person, yeah, yeah, letting her see more parts of myself. And,
00:17:57
you know, yeah,
00:17:59
Manon Bolliger: right, because you're allowed to discover it.
00:18:02
That's the other part, right? You know, it's like, What's it
00:18:05
like having grandchildren? What kind of grandparents are you?
00:18:08
You know, would you prefer, you know, traveling or spending time
00:18:13
there? How committed like, you know, what? Who comes first? You
00:18:17
know, all these things that you know, you kind of, you know,
00:18:21
yeah, we were all smiling at each other, going, Wow, I'm
00:18:26
looking forward to having the night with nobody around. How
00:18:30
weird, you know, because I'm such a family person, I would
00:18:33
never, ever have thought that I would actually be, you know,
00:18:38
happy, completely wonderful, right? That's ecstatic, yeah,
00:18:47
but I like the idea that when you're in something that's not
00:18:53
quite right, you know? I mean, there's all the blame games and
00:18:56
all that, but let's say you have a higher consciousness, and you
00:18:59
know that it's not about that. It's just partially you're not
00:19:03
being who you are. Yeah, and so there's triggers, something else
00:19:07
is attracting you that maybe you're working through but you
00:19:11
don't want to work through all the way. So it's stuck. The
00:19:14
relationship isn't growing. It's how do you part that amicably?
00:19:20
So what? What is it that you see that when people do it properly,
00:19:26
what happens for Yeah, for
00:19:27
Ken Blackman: you, yeah, which is interesting, because, you
00:19:31
know, some some couples that I work with do end up breaking up,
00:19:35
and what's funny is that they still send me, you know,
00:19:38
referrals, because they're so grateful for what they learned
00:19:42
and having made a decision that they feel good about. And I can
00:19:46
tell you what it sounds like. I'll tell you what it sounds
00:19:49
like when you it sounds like this. I totally see you, I
00:19:55
totally get you. I understand what it is that you're asking
00:19:59
for. For, and I don't think there's anything wrong with what
00:20:04
you're asking for. It's just out of my range, or it's not
00:20:07
something that I'm it's not something I want to do. And I
00:20:11
also feel like, I feel like you understand me. You under you. I
00:20:16
don't think there's any you know. You understand what it is
00:20:19
I'm asking for and what it is I want, and I respect that you
00:20:22
don't want to to. You know, it's out of your range to give me
00:20:26
what I'm asking for, or you don't want that. So, you know, I
00:20:33
have regret that, that we've come to this, this impasse. You
00:20:38
know, I love you dearly and and I am mourning the life that
00:20:45
we've had. I'm also celebrating if that we've had, and frankly,
00:20:49
I feel a sense of relief, along with all that, that we've come
00:20:53
to a decision and word deciding to move on with our lives. And
00:20:58
I'm excited for my next chapter. I looking, you know, I hope you
00:21:01
have your your next chapter is going to be good. And so that's
00:21:06
what it can sound like when you really have realized it's not a
00:21:10
good match. Is you both understand each other. You both
00:21:15
understand what the other one wants, and you know that it's
00:21:19
not what's what's going to work for you.
00:21:24
Manon Bolliger: But I mean, with that, both have to be at a
00:21:27
fairly conscious level, right? Because if I look at earlier
00:21:34
breakups, you know, I can't say either way. You know, I face my
00:21:41
part of being unconscious, as has the other. But I think it's
00:21:48
yeah, it it's like I my questions would be, well,
00:21:52
couldn't I? Couldn't I compromise that? Or couldn't I
00:21:55
change that? Is that, you know, isn't that such a is that such a
00:22:00
big deal. I totally get it. Why can't I blah, blah, blah, right?
00:22:04
You know, isn't that stuff something, at least, you know,
00:22:07
from one of the partners, do you see that a lot,
00:22:10
Ken Blackman: or the sense that you, you, you do, but, but the
00:22:14
thing is, like this kind of gets into the question of whether our
00:22:19
relationship is, quote, worth it, which is a whole topic unto
00:22:22
itself, worth it. You know what I mean? And I do see people
00:22:30
trying and trying and trying and trying, trying and bending
00:22:35
themselves into a pretzel. Do you know what I mean? Like
00:22:37
pretzeling themselves to try and make it work. But the well,
00:22:43
that's that is getting further and further and further away
00:22:46
from, you know, that's more that's more addiction than it is
00:22:49
love. That's more code codependent, yeah,
00:22:56
Manon Bolliger: yeah, no, I guess that's a good point. Yeah,
00:23:00
yeah. When you're constantly bending, it's like you're you're
00:23:05
too afraid to just say, No, whatever it might be, and no, I
00:23:09
don't want to move you across the universe, or, you know, or I
00:23:14
have children here, or whatever the story might be. That are a
00:23:18
value system significant enough, right?
00:23:23
Ken Blackman: If someone believes that they are
00:23:25
unlovable, it's going to be very scary to leave a relationship,
00:23:31
right? Yeah, if someone understands that they are
00:23:34
lovable and that they are worthy and that there's, you know,
00:23:38
there's plenty of opportunity to find someone else like if
00:23:41
they're if they like themselves, if they love them, they don't
00:23:45
have a hard time believing that someone else can like them and
00:23:47
love them, right? And it becomes easier to say, I love what we
00:23:51
have here, but there's something that I want more that I'm not
00:23:55
getting here. And so this isn't good enough. This isn't enough
00:24:00
from like, the good, the good here isn't good enough for me to
00:24:04
want to stay and compromise this thing that I actually hunger
00:24:07
for, that I'm not getting here, right?
00:24:10
Manon Bolliger: Yeah, that makes sense, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
00:24:13
you better get there, yeah. But that's what I mean. It takes a
00:24:15
certain consciousness to realize that you're, you know, you're
00:24:19
not in a where you're that it could be a codependent
00:24:22
relationship, right? Yeah, yeah. So have you ever dealt with
00:24:26
codependent relationships that the one of them might be super
00:24:31
attached to making it work, the other one is potentially ready
00:24:36
to move on? How do you deal with them?
00:24:39
Ken Blackman: Well, it's funny. So, you know, there's, there's
00:24:43
this talk these days about attachment styles, right? And so
00:24:48
there's anxiously attached. And often someone who's anxiously
00:24:52
attached will be in a relationship with someone who's
00:24:56
avoidantly attached. For some reason, the combination. Happens
00:25:00
a lot, yeah, but the truth is, on a practical level, the
00:25:06
anxiously attached one is actually the greater flight
00:25:09
risk. They're the they're the ones that are like so we're
00:25:18
literally anxious that about whether this relationship is
00:25:21
going to work and trying so hard, they're actually usually
00:25:25
the one that calls it first and says, This isn't this isn't
00:25:29
working for me. So when? So that that finding really surprised
00:25:35
me, because you you know, no, the person who has the most fear
00:25:40
of abandonment is more likely to leave than the avoidant one. The
00:25:48
avoidant one just has their walls up, right?
00:25:52
Manon Bolliger: Yeah, I guess what makes sense, yes. But
00:25:54
usually,
00:25:55
Ken Blackman: when the breakup happens, it's the it's the
00:25:57
anxiously attached one who does the breakup because they can't
00:26:01
stand the they can't stand the the indecisiveness. They can't
00:26:08
stand the partner having their walls up. They can't stand not
00:26:12
being not having connection. They can't stand their partner
00:26:15
running away. They like they they just get fed up with it,
00:26:20
right?
00:26:20
Manon Bolliger: Yeah, yeah, it does actually make sense. We can
00:26:25
break it down a bit more than it would be more of a trigger,
00:26:30
yeah, interesting. So we have like, five minutes left, and I
00:26:36
realized I've just been sounding it a question. Is there
00:26:39
something you would like to share right off of, you know,
00:26:42
and then also how, how people can get hold of you. How do you
00:26:45
work? Do you have any, yeah, you know, books that people can get,
00:26:50
or articles, or how do people find out about you? Just maybe,
00:26:53
you know, take the last
00:26:54
Ken Blackman: one, you know, there again, they're like, I
00:27:01
could talk for 18 or 20 hours about something, but I think
00:27:04
what, given what we've talked about so far, I want to leave
00:27:07
your your audience, with this thought, when your life is good,
00:27:14
you know when times are good, when things are going well in
00:27:17
your life in general, it's really easy To be in love and
00:27:21
have it feel wonderful, and then when things get hard, when it's
00:27:25
when life itself is challenging, like I live in Chicago right now
00:27:31
and it's challenging to be in Chicago right now. Oh yes, I can
00:27:33
imagine so. So whatever it is, if you're like when your life is
00:27:38
challenged, yes, you are going to learn something about your
00:27:42
relationship, because either you're going to be thinking,
00:27:47
this is really a difficult life situation, and I am so glad to
00:27:51
be going through this with you. I am so glad I have you by my
00:27:55
side during these challenges times, or your or your partner
00:28:02
is going to feel more burdensome. Like they're going
00:28:05
to feel like, you know, wow, I have all this stuff I'm trying
00:28:08
to deal with in my life, and now I have to deal with you too,
00:28:11
like, you know, it could feel like your partner is, is, is a
00:28:17
burden, and you'd be better off without them. So that tells you
00:28:23
something about the health and vitality of the relationship.
00:28:27
And so what you want to do, everything we've been talking
00:28:30
about, is what it takes to build that relationship, the kind of
00:28:34
relationship that feels like, you know, times are really
00:28:38
tough, and I am so grateful I'm not alone. I'm so grateful doing
00:28:42
this together. You know, all the stuff we've been talking about,
00:28:46
it's is for, for that kind of relationship?
00:28:50
Manon Bolliger: Yeah, well, it's a really good point, because, I
00:28:54
mean, there's always stressful periods, and there's general
00:28:57
stressors in life, but I think to many people. The last four or
00:29:02
five years has been very stressful and, and it's, it's
00:29:08
brought some people apart because of fundamental
00:29:13
differences in in belief, you know, and, and then you know, if
00:29:18
you're the tin hat boiled person or the oddball, that whatever
00:29:22
stands up, you know, it's going to bring you a hell of a lot
00:29:27
closer. If your partner is on the same page and you're like,
00:29:32
Thank God there's peace, otherwise you feel like you're
00:29:36
having crazy right? So I think this can really, yeah, it can
00:29:42
make the relationship even closer, because it's a tough
00:29:45
time to stand up, endless, you know, yeah, interesting.
00:29:51
Ken Blackman: Now, as far as, as far as how to reach me, I'll
00:29:55
give you a URL to my blog. No, like this is, this is where. You
00:30:00
can really read more about me, and you can find links to to
00:30:04
reach out to me if you want support or coaching. So it's Ken
00:30:10
blackmon.medium.com, Ken blackman.medium.com, great.
00:30:17
Manon Bolliger: And then we'll have it also written on the
00:30:19
website and everything, so people can get hold of you.
00:30:23
Well, thank you. That's a lot of information in a short half an
00:30:27
hour, but I think we covered quite a bit. I'm sure there's so
00:30:31
much more.
00:30:32
Ken Blackman: Thank you so much for having me on. It's been a
00:30:34
great yeah, no,
00:30:35
Manon Bolliger: I find this, you know, fascinating, and all of
00:30:39
these aspects impact health. Okay, thank you.
00:30:46
Ending: Thank you for joining us at the healers cafe. If you
00:30:51
haven't already done so, please like comment and subscribe with
00:30:55
notifications on as I post a new podcast every Wednesday with
00:31:01
tons of useful information and tips for natural healing that
00:31:05
you won't want to miss you.